Zeke
Jun 15, 2017

pollination

26 comments

When we at the spring seminar Russ talked about pumpkins only getting as big as what the plant would support at the time it's pollinated. (don't know how to say this)

 

First case - female at 8 feet out. Pumpkin is set and will only get as big as the supporting plant allows so we should terminate growth.

 

Second case - another female at 12 feet . Now is this pumpkin looking at the support of the existing plant plus the competition of the pumpkin at 8 feet?

 

If you want a pollination at 12 feet should you cull the 8 footer right away so it doesn't affect the 12 foot.

John Butler
Jun 15, 2017

I personally do not pollinate at eight feet I remove it before it opens

Phil & Jane Hunt - GVGO
Jun 16, 2017

I would wait for the one at 12'. 8' is too small of a plant. Lots of time left to pollinate pumpkins. Our target date is June 20th - 25th. Hope this helps.

Jane & Phil

Ryan
Jun 16, 2017

I'd remove the 8 footer, pollinate the 12 footer and also pollinate the next one that shows after the 12' mark. Don't get too stressed out about the calendar. Watch the 12' foot pollination for 10 days or so and see how it compares to the one further down the line. I usually end up keeping the later pollination. I'd rather have a later pollination on a large plant, rather than a pollination this week on a small plant. It's a long year, and in September you're going to be wishing you had some fresher growth to feed the fruit.

 

I look at secondaries more so than feet of main vine. I won't pollinate anything unless there's 20 secondaries behind it. I'd prefer 22-24 if I'm ahead of schedule on plant growth.

 

Last year I had 28-32 secondaries feeding the three fruit that I set, which was too much since it pushed me back to July 5th on pollination.

balk
Jun 17, 2017

Ok. So, I've allready pollinated at 6ft. Rookie mistake. I have one at 9ft and one at 12ft. It sounds like

I should wait for the 12 footer at least. I will terminate the 6ft. My question is this, Has my plant been comprimised by allowing the 6 ft. pollination? Is that what Russ was talking about?

Chris L
Jun 18, 2017

The growth clock starts after a fruit is pollinated but because it is still early a pollination at 9 or 12 feet would still be a better bet with the likely hood of better weight gain per day from a larger plant.

balk
Jun 18, 2017

Thanks for the input Chris. Zeke and I had a long discussion about this and we agree with you. Off it comes.

jr.landry
Jun 23, 2017

Growth Hormones Auxiin,, Giiberrelllliic Aciid & Cytokine 's.

Cytokinins (Cyt) like those found in kelp are a group of chemical hormones or plant growth regulators that influence cell division and shoot formation. Also Cyt helps to delay senescence of tissues in August. Cyt is responsible for moderating auxin transport throughout the plant, and its affects internodal length, Fruit and stem cell division and leaf size. Lower levels of auxins are known to slow growth in May. Cytokinins over-come apical dominance or the growth of shoots which is a major benefit for enhancing cell division in the fruit and peduncles.  Therefore Cytokines are thought to induce cell division and regulation of the fruits cells just after pollination. The more cells a fruit has the more it can expand and thus grow larger. I suggest timing is everything Hold off on applications of Kelps which contain cytokinins until just before the pollination bud develops > this goes for the synthetic types as well. Synthetic Kinetin is a type of Cytokinin is commonly used in rooting products. "Root Booster" is a good product that does not contain kinetin. So avoiding large amounts seaweeds well help to speed up meristematic shoot tip growth leading up to pollination time. IF YOU want a bigger plant before pollination then hold off on Kelp. YOU MUST terminate everything a few days before pollination time. The sooner you do this the more auxin will be inhibited in the meristems. The cells of a fruit will develop freely without conflicting signals from competing hormones. Don’t worry about the plants size it's simply irrelevant as by pollination time the final fruit size is already determined at 48 hours or so after pollination. FInd a source of cytokine and apply it within 48 hours of pollination to induce cell division for a longer time period. I am currently spraying my maters twice a day with seaweed to enhance cell division. Certainly I'm positive that 3,000 is coming soon! Russ :)

jr.landry
Jun 23, 2017

So, i know its hard to understand for most folks....We need to loose our paradigm.....You see which ever fruit you choose and whenever you choose it the plants future size does not determine fruit size....its instead how many cells the fruit has that determines the size in October......Many a grower has debated this with me.....But one can't argue science facts.....the rest is fiction....I have studied this extensively.....we need only to look at the 8.41MacCoy for proof.....Small plants can and do produce giant fruit simply because if you enhance cell division the pipes become bigger and better.

jr.landry
Jun 23, 2017

Please a few of you try this right now on a plant or two.....when you pick THE ONE start by terminating all growth IMMEDIATELY.....spray the fruit and pendunckle with kelp or seaweed or other cytokines and or Ethylene too.....This should begin just as you see the fruit buds developing and end 10 days after pollination....Collect grass clippings or other green waste in a sealed bag....place in sunlight for a few hours or so......bring the bag to the pollinated flower within 48 hours of pollination. Pinch a tiny, tiny hole in the bag with a pin. Puff the air inside the bag over the fruit and stem. The ethylene gas in the bag will trigger in the plant a response to stimulate cell division.......Come and tell me in the fall at Port Elgin that you have just won the GVGO 1 Ton Challenge.....This is the primary result of years of research I have done along with Matt Debaco, Brad Wursten, Joe Ailts and a few good doctors and scientists who have studied the plumbing of the AGP.

P.S. I'm back in the game........Bahahahahaha........

Russ

jr.landry
Jun 23, 2017

How to make Ethylene gas.

Zip lock plastic bags work best. Place in the bag a fresh pumpkin leaves or a newly aborted or culled fruit. Don't worry about crushing the leaves.....seal the bag tightly and make sure that there is a little air in the bag. You want to ensure that the bag is not free from all air as the oxygen will help to produce ethylene more effectively. So a little is just right. Place in a warm, partially shaded area to start the gas building process...it will not take long.....By following this procedure you are creating an accurate means of collecting the plants own natural ethylene production.....................

Check on the bags every few hours. Looking for signs of ripening or decay, you can begin to see the rate of ethylene production with the fruits. In short order you will have concrete evidence of the creation of ethylene gas as the bag will begin to puff up as the gases are released from the green matter inside. Currently I have three bags on the go this morning......Follow he steps above wait a few hours and repeat for a few days.......Now watch it grow.....

Zeke
Jun 23, 2017

Pheeeeeeeeuw thanks Russ

John Butler
Jun 24, 2017

Is the seaweed spray full strength or are you mixing it with water

jr.landry
Jun 24, 2017

Depends on the concentration. I have been using a concentrated mix that Ron sells. The result is a week solution with water.

John Butler
Jun 24, 2017

i have the seaweed that the GVGO sells I think its neptunes

John Butler
Jun 24, 2017

a seed soaking mixture is 1 tsp / cup of water

jr.landry
Jun 24, 2017

OK, John thats goods stuff too..... So, find a small hand pump type sprayer.....I use a 1 liter hand sprayer to do the deed..... Mix it just like that and spray in morning and evening.....Drench the little bastard and its stem area profusely.....Just do it to one plant AGP and a few tow-maters and LG's or other fruit to compare.....And don't forget to puff with ethylene up to and during the first 48 hours after pollination.....by end of season you will have a personal best....Kelp and or seaweed can be sprayed on the fruit and stem all season long at reduced rates and intervals........

 

Note to John: I know you'll understand this.... the procedure outlined is called Cytokinensis its the cell division process during which a single cell divides into two daughter cells.

 

This is the poor mans solution to using that PGR's and other chemicals...... You first heard about this several years ago. The marketed PGR that regulates cell division is called Forchlorfenuron and is used in apple and fruit orchards.....so some you may already have heard of it......

 

Physiological effects of cytokinins are primarily Cell division. The most important biological effect of kinetin on plants is to induce cell division......

 

This link is terrific....

http://eagri.tnau.ac.in/eagri50/PPHY261/lec20.pdf

Pumpkin Shepherd
Jun 24, 2017

Perfect timing Russ, I just cut the (overgrown) lawn this morning and made a bunch of Ethylene Puffer Pillows ™. I need all the help I can get this year.

John Butler
Jun 24, 2017

thanks Russ I will give it a go

jr.landry
Jun 25, 2017

IMO its best to use Big Zac or Delicious leaves as the ethylene will be most reactive to the plant. You can also Beef Stake tomatoes placed in a zip lock and left to stew for awhile.....I'm going out to puff Rusty Red this morning with a two day old baggy filed with Big Zac leaves...

jr.landry
Jun 27, 2017

Don't wast time growing salad!

 

"There was no evidence that changes in leaf area or

photosynthetic capacity impacted fruit size. Instead, giant

varieties differed in their ovary morphology and contained

more phloem on a cross-sectional area basis in their petioles

and pedicels than the ancestral variety. These results suggest

that sink activity is important in determining fruit size and

that giant pumpkins have an enhanced capacity to transport

carbon."

 

http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/pce.12502/epdf?r3_referer=wol&tracking_action=preview_click&show_checkout=1&purchase_referrer=www.google.ca&purchase_site_license=LICENSE_DENIED

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